Here is our thread for Session 1 questions. I’ll try and get to them as we go forward. You can also use this as a way to meet other writers and create writers groups if you like.
Hi Alexander, thank you for a fantastic discussion. I was wondering if you could speak more about the literal question posed: what is a novel for? I'm so curious about how to answer this. What is the experience of a 'successful' novel for a reader? By successful I mean, why do some novels move us and change us? What form does the energy of a novel take? What kind of experience does it allow for? As opposed to, say, the form of energy and offered experience of an essay or short story. I'm particularly interested in how the reading of a novel works, and how we, as writers, can be generous with our readers if we understand how novels transform, rearrange, uplift through that reading experience.
Hi! Can you say more on creating a memory map for a fictional character? any guidance on creating "memories" for someone who isn't real -- is the idea to use your own memories for them? Thank you!
Hi Alex, thank you so much for the class and apologies for getting to all this material so late! If I'm not too late to ask, I was wondering if you had any advice to offer on how to begin a practice in novel writing.
As someone who generally prefers writing short stories and understands the rhythms and compressions of the short story form, I'm terrified at the prospect of novel writing (which is to say, perhaps, I'm just scared of the unknown and the loss of control). But I'm attracted to it at the same time, and even more so after your class/the literature you referenced.
Novels are for their writers, first: this is the thing that someone has to make, as opposed to making a short story or a prose poem or a sailboat. (I'd love to write things that take less than 3-10 years to make, but it seems I have to make novels.) If you stay sane long enough to finish a novel, then it's for its readers. Most of us will have few readers, those who make it past the gates will have more. Either way, the possibilities for readers are plentiful: entertainment, education, protest, championing (people, causes, ideas), skewering, grieving, romancing, forgetting, and a hundred others, at least. To me the best novels have a core of unresolved mystery, opening a door into a dark room whose contents can only be speculated. Novel is a form is a basket: anything can fill the basket.
Hi Alex, Thank you for a rich and interesting first session. Do you find it essential to identify what you're making (novel, novella, connected stories, etc.) while you're writing? Sometimes, it feels like analyzing what we're doing pulls us out of the creative work. On the other hand, understanding the different forms and identifying with one or the other may help a writer find direction....
hi there! Was wondering if you had more instructive advice on how to use memory mapping as a tool for a starting off point of a new work, especially with regards to a work of fiction? Thanks so much.
Hi Alex, I don't have any questions yet but I just wanted to say thank you for being so generous with your knowledge and time. For someone like me who did an undergraduate degree in literature but in the 20+ years since has kind of cobbled together my own learning path as far as writing goes, it's wonderful to have an opportunity to hear you 'lecture.' :) Kaz
Hello Alexander and cohort – Last week I read the three volume version of An Angel at My Table by Janet Frame, which I found to be quite wonderful. I have not read many autobiographies that I remember (and if I don't remember them did I read them?) but I noticed something about the style that seems worth an inquiry.
It seemed to me, while I was reading, that she allowed the reader to see through her eyes, and her mind, her inner world, at her age under discussion in the book. IOW, it seemed less like a description of what she experienced in her historical context, and more like a record of what she was feeling and what it meant to her. She also seems to be able to conjure what she saw at the time, but tells it in context of the whole, not as she goes along in the chronology.
I suppose my first question is: Is my interpretation of her approach reasonable? And then: Is this common and I simply haven't see it previously? Or is this The Way It's Best Done? Are there other literary examples where this style / approach is easily observed? To be clear, "this style / approach" in my mind is "less literal and more literary," more psychological. I'm open to clarification on my interpretation, certainly!
Hi! I loved your discussion of Jesus' Son in terms of the power of what's left out, the blank spaces between the stories being so essential to the energy and excitement of the book. You presented it alongside the stereoscopic perspectives/dramatic irony discussion as both are devices for giving the reader space to do some of that satisfying interpretive work that makes fiction so exciting. There's such an impulse in the writing process (at least for me) to move linearly, connect the dots, be detailed and comprehensive, but (to my tastes) this can really kill the writing. There's a balance between clarity and leaving room for the reader's imagination to have it's own engagement with telling the story. I'm not a huge mystery buff, but at some level, dosen't fiction need to have some mystery to keep the energy up, give the reader something to wrestle with that gets them on that process of discovery? This also gets me thinking about the idea you brought up that in a stereoscopic novel the characters don't need to change, because the ultimate pay-off is not on the page, but in the reader's comprehension/assembly of all the perspectives into a new (changed?) whole. After producing much bad writing through dilligent 'make myself sit down and write', that usually produced linear, boring, souless pages, I let myself be more exploratory, along the lines of your memory map exercises, and have begun to see the sort of flashes of different moments, perspectives ideas, that with some assembly I can imagine as becoming a sort of narrative. The question is, how much of those gaps to fill in? Jesus' Son is an infinitely rereadable book, because there is always more to discover precisely because of how much is left out, with each reread a reader is likely to fill in those gaps in slightly different ways. But how do you write with a focus on what you're not writing....
(Also, bummed I can't make the live version, as I teach Wednesday nights, but glad to have the asynchronous option)
Thank you so much for bringing up the bildungsroman/kunstlerroman in class because I had a few questions about this form. When I think of these kinds of books, old classics like Stendhal’s The Red and The Black or Charlotte Brontë’s Jane Eyre or Alice Munro’s The Lives of Girls and Women. They usually have a linear chronology and are usually told in the first person. How flexible are these rules? I just about died having to read all the description and backstory in The Red and The Black. Can a Bildungsroman dip into memory to compress the story or does it have to be linear? Can the timeline be compressed to one year of learning? Does it have to be told in the first person? And finally does a Bildungsroman have to come to agreement with society’s values at the end? Or can the protagonist be in disagreement with society’s values but still have received an education? I think I’m writing a Bildungsroman and switched from the POV from 3rd to 1st which I think is working better in terms of closeness to the characters thoughts but sometimes I prefer third person for the ease of moving into description that doesn’t seem out of character. Does that make any sense? I found the example We The Animals interesting because the book is unfolds linearly but the film uses memory (drowning scene) effectively to portray trauma. Also admired the way Torres changed the POV to show the individuation of the protagonist. Anyway, I found your class extremely helpful and inspiring. And thank you in advance if you have the time to respond to these questions.
Jan 23, 2023·edited Jan 24, 2023Liked by Alexander Chee
Hi Alex,
Loved the first session and I can't wait for the second one.
A lot of the discussion was focused around finding threads or concrete blocks of memories to get going. I loved that.
How do you tackle finding the right form for those memories? As a story starts to take shape, how do you experiment with developing the narrative and finding the right form to convey it?
Alex, as always, you presented a wondrous, roving mass of material I'll likely spend a lifetime cycling and recycling. I wondered if you could dig a little deeper on the concept/form/qualities of stereoscopic fiction. This piqued my interest and may've presented an answer to assisting me with my current novel-in-progress. Anything you can say on stereoscopic fiction would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
Hello. You mentioned Edmund White’s The Married Man as one of three novels in which the author renegotiated material. What were the other two? Thank you.
You spoke about interconnected stories last night, and I loved the example of Fiona and Jane; how the form allowed the reader to see the story from the perspectives of both characters, and over time. What do you think the opportunities of the connected stories form would be for a story told primarily through the POV of a single character? Perhaps a chance to play with time and the fallibility of memory, with separate stories covering some of the same action, with different outcomes or takes on it? Does anything else come to mind? I've had some trouble getting a novel to coalesce and a mentor suggested trying it as connected stories. I'm more intrigued by this possibility after your talk, but also hesitant/scared to start tearing up chapters and the attempts I've made to shape the novel's arc. I wonder if this kind of form switch would be something you could outline or storyboard, or if it would take actually doing it (all) to see if it works. Would love your thoughts on any of this!
Hello Druid :-), I just finished reading How to Write an Autobiographical Novel and it made me want to write an essay collection in response :-) It's tremendous! Your writing assignment (first novel you loved) inspired me to write about an obscure historical novel about a relationship between a teenage boy and a man in his 20's both of whom meet as trapeze artists. It's by a famous sci-fi author (Marion Zimmer Bradley, author of Mists of Avalon). I just found out that after her death, she was accused of being a child molester by her children. I'm drafting an essay reckoning with her influence and how I'm mourning my loss of innocence.
1. Do you have any suggestions for where to publish this?
2. Did you use the Fool's Journey to map out your essay collection? If so, at what point did you do this?
3. Since sexual abuse is a triggering term, and I have not written about this topic before, any tips for how to pitch a piece about this? For example, is it better to use S.A. as an acronym, or have a trigger warning?
4. My associative mind links the word 'monster' (as MZB was called in a recent YouTube video about the allegations) to my own experience of leaving a voicemail for my first boyfriend, after I broke up with him, where I said, "Sorry I've Become This Monster. I Love You A Lot." He then turned the voicemail into a song. I'm considering writing about the uncomfortable ways in which MZB's influence contributed to my lacking the skills to navigate ending this relationship. This topic feels edgy and potentially makes me squirm because my first book was for an Indian audience, and I was told NOT to write in the "confessional American style" by my editor. How did you overcome any cultural hangups against being confessional that you might have faced? Any general thoughts on the topic of strategic disclosure of vulnerability? Thanks :-)
Hi Alexander, thank you for a fantastic discussion. I was wondering if you could speak more about the literal question posed: what is a novel for? I'm so curious about how to answer this. What is the experience of a 'successful' novel for a reader? By successful I mean, why do some novels move us and change us? What form does the energy of a novel take? What kind of experience does it allow for? As opposed to, say, the form of energy and offered experience of an essay or short story. I'm particularly interested in how the reading of a novel works, and how we, as writers, can be generous with our readers if we understand how novels transform, rearrange, uplift through that reading experience.
Hi! Can you say more on creating a memory map for a fictional character? any guidance on creating "memories" for someone who isn't real -- is the idea to use your own memories for them? Thank you!
Hi Alex, thank you so much for the class and apologies for getting to all this material so late! If I'm not too late to ask, I was wondering if you had any advice to offer on how to begin a practice in novel writing.
As someone who generally prefers writing short stories and understands the rhythms and compressions of the short story form, I'm terrified at the prospect of novel writing (which is to say, perhaps, I'm just scared of the unknown and the loss of control). But I'm attracted to it at the same time, and even more so after your class/the literature you referenced.
Novels are for their writers, first: this is the thing that someone has to make, as opposed to making a short story or a prose poem or a sailboat. (I'd love to write things that take less than 3-10 years to make, but it seems I have to make novels.) If you stay sane long enough to finish a novel, then it's for its readers. Most of us will have few readers, those who make it past the gates will have more. Either way, the possibilities for readers are plentiful: entertainment, education, protest, championing (people, causes, ideas), skewering, grieving, romancing, forgetting, and a hundred others, at least. To me the best novels have a core of unresolved mystery, opening a door into a dark room whose contents can only be speculated. Novel is a form is a basket: anything can fill the basket.
Hi Alex, Thank you for a rich and interesting first session. Do you find it essential to identify what you're making (novel, novella, connected stories, etc.) while you're writing? Sometimes, it feels like analyzing what we're doing pulls us out of the creative work. On the other hand, understanding the different forms and identifying with one or the other may help a writer find direction....
hi there! Was wondering if you had more instructive advice on how to use memory mapping as a tool for a starting off point of a new work, especially with regards to a work of fiction? Thanks so much.
Hi Alex, I don't have any questions yet but I just wanted to say thank you for being so generous with your knowledge and time. For someone like me who did an undergraduate degree in literature but in the 20+ years since has kind of cobbled together my own learning path as far as writing goes, it's wonderful to have an opportunity to hear you 'lecture.' :) Kaz
Hello Alexander and cohort – Last week I read the three volume version of An Angel at My Table by Janet Frame, which I found to be quite wonderful. I have not read many autobiographies that I remember (and if I don't remember them did I read them?) but I noticed something about the style that seems worth an inquiry.
It seemed to me, while I was reading, that she allowed the reader to see through her eyes, and her mind, her inner world, at her age under discussion in the book. IOW, it seemed less like a description of what she experienced in her historical context, and more like a record of what she was feeling and what it meant to her. She also seems to be able to conjure what she saw at the time, but tells it in context of the whole, not as she goes along in the chronology.
I suppose my first question is: Is my interpretation of her approach reasonable? And then: Is this common and I simply haven't see it previously? Or is this The Way It's Best Done? Are there other literary examples where this style / approach is easily observed? To be clear, "this style / approach" in my mind is "less literal and more literary," more psychological. I'm open to clarification on my interpretation, certainly!
Hi! I loved your discussion of Jesus' Son in terms of the power of what's left out, the blank spaces between the stories being so essential to the energy and excitement of the book. You presented it alongside the stereoscopic perspectives/dramatic irony discussion as both are devices for giving the reader space to do some of that satisfying interpretive work that makes fiction so exciting. There's such an impulse in the writing process (at least for me) to move linearly, connect the dots, be detailed and comprehensive, but (to my tastes) this can really kill the writing. There's a balance between clarity and leaving room for the reader's imagination to have it's own engagement with telling the story. I'm not a huge mystery buff, but at some level, dosen't fiction need to have some mystery to keep the energy up, give the reader something to wrestle with that gets them on that process of discovery? This also gets me thinking about the idea you brought up that in a stereoscopic novel the characters don't need to change, because the ultimate pay-off is not on the page, but in the reader's comprehension/assembly of all the perspectives into a new (changed?) whole. After producing much bad writing through dilligent 'make myself sit down and write', that usually produced linear, boring, souless pages, I let myself be more exploratory, along the lines of your memory map exercises, and have begun to see the sort of flashes of different moments, perspectives ideas, that with some assembly I can imagine as becoming a sort of narrative. The question is, how much of those gaps to fill in? Jesus' Son is an infinitely rereadable book, because there is always more to discover precisely because of how much is left out, with each reread a reader is likely to fill in those gaps in slightly different ways. But how do you write with a focus on what you're not writing....
(Also, bummed I can't make the live version, as I teach Wednesday nights, but glad to have the asynchronous option)
Hi Alex,
Thank you so much for bringing up the bildungsroman/kunstlerroman in class because I had a few questions about this form. When I think of these kinds of books, old classics like Stendhal’s The Red and The Black or Charlotte Brontë’s Jane Eyre or Alice Munro’s The Lives of Girls and Women. They usually have a linear chronology and are usually told in the first person. How flexible are these rules? I just about died having to read all the description and backstory in The Red and The Black. Can a Bildungsroman dip into memory to compress the story or does it have to be linear? Can the timeline be compressed to one year of learning? Does it have to be told in the first person? And finally does a Bildungsroman have to come to agreement with society’s values at the end? Or can the protagonist be in disagreement with society’s values but still have received an education? I think I’m writing a Bildungsroman and switched from the POV from 3rd to 1st which I think is working better in terms of closeness to the characters thoughts but sometimes I prefer third person for the ease of moving into description that doesn’t seem out of character. Does that make any sense? I found the example We The Animals interesting because the book is unfolds linearly but the film uses memory (drowning scene) effectively to portray trauma. Also admired the way Torres changed the POV to show the individuation of the protagonist. Anyway, I found your class extremely helpful and inspiring. And thank you in advance if you have the time to respond to these questions.
Take care,
Erin
Hi Alex,
Loved the first session and I can't wait for the second one.
A lot of the discussion was focused around finding threads or concrete blocks of memories to get going. I loved that.
How do you tackle finding the right form for those memories? As a story starts to take shape, how do you experiment with developing the narrative and finding the right form to convey it?
Alex, as always, you presented a wondrous, roving mass of material I'll likely spend a lifetime cycling and recycling. I wondered if you could dig a little deeper on the concept/form/qualities of stereoscopic fiction. This piqued my interest and may've presented an answer to assisting me with my current novel-in-progress. Anything you can say on stereoscopic fiction would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
Hello. You mentioned Edmund White’s The Married Man as one of three novels in which the author renegotiated material. What were the other two? Thank you.
Hi Alex,
You spoke about interconnected stories last night, and I loved the example of Fiona and Jane; how the form allowed the reader to see the story from the perspectives of both characters, and over time. What do you think the opportunities of the connected stories form would be for a story told primarily through the POV of a single character? Perhaps a chance to play with time and the fallibility of memory, with separate stories covering some of the same action, with different outcomes or takes on it? Does anything else come to mind? I've had some trouble getting a novel to coalesce and a mentor suggested trying it as connected stories. I'm more intrigued by this possibility after your talk, but also hesitant/scared to start tearing up chapters and the attempts I've made to shape the novel's arc. I wonder if this kind of form switch would be something you could outline or storyboard, or if it would take actually doing it (all) to see if it works. Would love your thoughts on any of this!
Hello Druid :-), I just finished reading How to Write an Autobiographical Novel and it made me want to write an essay collection in response :-) It's tremendous! Your writing assignment (first novel you loved) inspired me to write about an obscure historical novel about a relationship between a teenage boy and a man in his 20's both of whom meet as trapeze artists. It's by a famous sci-fi author (Marion Zimmer Bradley, author of Mists of Avalon). I just found out that after her death, she was accused of being a child molester by her children. I'm drafting an essay reckoning with her influence and how I'm mourning my loss of innocence.
1. Do you have any suggestions for where to publish this?
2. Did you use the Fool's Journey to map out your essay collection? If so, at what point did you do this?
3. Since sexual abuse is a triggering term, and I have not written about this topic before, any tips for how to pitch a piece about this? For example, is it better to use S.A. as an acronym, or have a trigger warning?
4. My associative mind links the word 'monster' (as MZB was called in a recent YouTube video about the allegations) to my own experience of leaving a voicemail for my first boyfriend, after I broke up with him, where I said, "Sorry I've Become This Monster. I Love You A Lot." He then turned the voicemail into a song. I'm considering writing about the uncomfortable ways in which MZB's influence contributed to my lacking the skills to navigate ending this relationship. This topic feels edgy and potentially makes me squirm because my first book was for an Indian audience, and I was told NOT to write in the "confessional American style" by my editor. How did you overcome any cultural hangups against being confessional that you might have faced? Any general thoughts on the topic of strategic disclosure of vulnerability? Thanks :-)